THE BOOK cover
The Unwritten Book is Finally Written!
An in-depth analysis of: The sacrifice bunt, batter/pitcher matchups, the intentional base on balls, optimizing a batting lineup, hot and cold streaks, clutch performance, platooning strategies, and much more.
Read Excerpts & Customer Reviews
If you are a media member and would like a review copy of The Book, please contact Kevin Cuddihy of Potomac Books.

Buy The Book from Amazon

MOST RECENT ARTICLES
MAIL : You ask | We say

Advanced


THE BOOK--Playing The Percentages In Baseball

<< Back to main

Tuesday, April 24, 2007

Should women tennis players get as much as the men?

By Tangotiger, 02:16 PM

No, not necessarily.

Those who support equal pay for equal work would say that it’s obvious that they should.  Just because one group has different genitalia from the other group doesn’t mean they should be compensated differently.  However, compensation is tied-in to revenue.  If you can generate more revenue than someone else, regarless of gender, you get paid more.  We wouldn’t presume that WNBA players should get paid as much as NBA players.  Why do the same in tennis?

Because in tennis, the women and men play in the same tournaments, so it seems hard to determine who is really generating the revenue.  But, with the Canadian Open, we have something interesting: the men and women play in alternating venues each year, in Toronto and Montreal.  This year, the men are in Montreal and the women are in Toronto.  The total purse for the men is 2.2 million$.  The total purse for the women is 1.34 million$.  It seems to me that regardless of how many sets per match, how many rounds, the gender, etc, it all comes down to generating revenue.  And the men are generating around 62% of the revenue.

So, what Wimbledon is doing is simply not right.  Furthermore, I would imagine that the talent distribution among women is much wider than for men.  So, even if for each tournament the men get 62% of the purse, it’s still likely that the top 5 earners in each sport might earn the same when looking at it over a series of tournaments (though this example is less clear with Roger Federer around).  I imagine that Henin-Hardenne, Sharapova, Mauresmo, and Clijsters are in the final 8 in most tournaments they play in.  I don’t think it’s nearly the case for the men (Federer excepted), like Nadal, Roddick and Davydenko.  This would mean that because the men are less likely to finish in the big money, they get a smaller portion of a bigger pie compared to the women, leaving them with the same total earnings.  But, that’s just a theory.

The 62/38 seems to me based on reality.


#1          (see all posts) 2007/04/24 (Tue) @ 16:04

Agree completely.

What the critics fail to consider is that if the market is reasonably free, it’s not the organizers who determine the pay—it’s the consumers.  If fewer fans are willing to buy tickets to see the women, then it’s the millions of men’s tennis fans who are the bigots.

Personally, I think it’s just that most people want to see the best in the world, regardless of sex.  And that’s the men.

When there are sports at which the best men and the best women are of approximately equal talent, and they play against each other, they get paid equally.  Poker is the only one that comes to mind—I know it’s not really a sport, but they show it on ESPN.  Or golf—if Annika Sorenstam had won those PGA tournaments she entered, she would have been paid exactly as much as the man who won.

Are there any segregated sports where women are as good as men, and we can check their respective pay?  Figure skating?  Gymnastics?


#2    tangotiger      (see all posts) 2007/04/24 (Tue) @ 16:36

Great way to put it… it’s the consumers who decide, and the (honest) organizers simply reflect that.

Figure skating is the one that came to mind.  In the Olympics, it’s the women’s figure skating and men’s hockey that are the main attractions.  Of course, if hockey wasn’t a popular sport, maybe Sergei Federov and Paul Kariya would have been figure skaters, and more money would be flowing to men’s figure skating.

Don’t forget that in Hollywood, it’s the male actors that rule for the most part, even though Meryl Streep is the greatest actor in the world.


#3    Jim P      (see all posts) 2007/04/24 (Tue) @ 16:45

Usually, the women’s final is on Saturday and the men’s final is on Sunday.  You could check television ratings and advertising rates.


#4    David Gassko      (see all posts) 2007/04/24 (Tue) @ 17:32

Figure skating is the one that came to mind.  In the Olympics, it’s the women’s figure skating and men’s hockey that are the main attractions.  Of course, if hockey wasn’t a popular sport, maybe Sergei Federov and Paul Kariya would have been figure skaters, and more money would be flowing to men’s figure skating.

***

It’s possible that women’s figure skating gets higher ratings, but the men are certainly more skilled, in terms of being able to do more rotations in their jumps, etc.


#5    tangotiger      (see all posts) 2007/04/24 (Tue) @ 19:13

They are stronger, doesn’t mean they are better.  And it doesn’t matter who is better… just who generates more interest. I’m sure there are plenty of college football teams that draw more interest than NFL Teams.


#6          (see all posts) 2007/04/25 (Wed) @ 08:50

I think archery is the only sport I know of in which women are on a relatively equal level with men.  You might find something similar in rifle shooting as well, not sure.


#7    tangotiger      (see all posts) 2007/04/25 (Wed) @ 09:30

Jim/3: you could.  My point is that this work has already been done because of the Canadian Open.  It’s the perfect experiment, as there’s barely any cross-promotion.  And they don’t even run concurrently (2-day overlap).

Mike/6: you mean that there’s intergender competition in archery and rifle shooting?  Even if that is so, you have to look at the pool of players.  Take billiards, where the chromosomes and testosterones don’t come into play.  Far more men play pool than women.  So, even if women have the same potential to win, they are swamped by the sheer number of men (and their experience).  Same for poker and chess I’d imagine.


#8    studes      (see all posts) 2007/04/25 (Wed) @ 21:31

Just my opinion but, at Wimbledon, I find women’s tennis much more enjoyable than men’s, similar to how I enjoy college basketball over the pros.  Just because one gender is stronger, doesn’t make them more enjoyable to watch.

Wimbledon’s grass surface makes many matches nothing more than quick serve games in men’s tennis.  I also think that players like Sharapova have as much marketing appeal as Federer and Nadal.  I think Wimbledon is right to have split the pot evenly.


#9    tangotiger      (see all posts) 2007/04/26 (Thu) @ 10:23

I agree with studes that the enjoyment quality does not necessarily match the talent quality.  And the marketing of inferior players can certainly be greater than those of better players.  And, if we had no social experiment or surveys to tell us otherwise, if one wanted to take the position that the winner of a tennis tournament should receive the same amount, regardless of gender, that’d be a fair opinion.

But against that is the Canadian Open (Rogers Cup).  Unless you believe that Tennis Canada is not allocating the purse money based on the revenue generated (i.e., taking revenue from the women’s tournament and giving it to the men’s), then your position is rather weak.

You could argue that the synergy of having both men’s and women’s at Wimbledon at the same time has an additional impact, that the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.  From that perspective, you could, maybe, argue that they should get equal pay.

But, I think you’ve got a greater mountain to climb than I do in proving your case.  If the revenue generated is 62/38, then that’s what each side should get.


Page 1 of 1 pages


Name (required)
E-Mail (optional)
Website (optional)

<< Back to main


Latest...

COMMENTS

Jan 09 16:41
Sabermetric Moves of the 2009 Pre-Season

Jan 09 22:11
Modeling Baseball Player Ability with a Nested Dirichlet Distribution

Jan 09 18:08
Line Drives

Jan 09 18:04
Challenging Nate Silver (and all other forecasters)

Jan 09 17:31
Cheers

Jan 09 17:14
Teaching sabermetrics at school

Jan 09 16:51
The first Hardball Times Annual available for download!

Jan 09 14:44
Vote for the Worst Player in MLB

Jan 09 12:29
Clint Eastwood is Archie Bunker

Jan 09 12:16
Mailbags on Parade