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Wednesday, March 18, 2009

Offensive rates as a function of base/out state…

By , 11:50 PM

I have spend a lot of computing time (it takes forever to “run") trying to figure out what the league average rates for the various offensive categories are as a function of the base/out state.  Any differences from overall rates would be due to batters and pitchers changing their approach and the fielders being in different positions and perhaps doing different things when the ball is hit to them.

It appears from the data that the batters trump the pitcher in terms of their approach (although, as you will see, there are times when the pitchers truno the batters, as with BB and HP rates), or perhaps the pitchers don’t “care” as much as the batters, and perhaps rightfully so.  For example, with a runner on second base and no outs, batters in general (lefties and righties, BTW), do in fact hit more balls to the right side, even though to some extent the pitcher is trying to “force” then to hit to the left side.  We mostly see that effect with no outs, BTW, which is pretty much what we would expect.  If a commentator ever tries to say that batters try and hit to the right side with a runner on second and ONE out, don’t believe him (it is certainly possible that that happens SOME of the time - but on average, there is not much evidence of that).

For all situations other than at least a runner on second and no outs, batters hit fly balls to the left side 51 or 52% of the time and ground balls .55 or .56.  This is RHB and LHB combined.  With no outs, however, and a runner on second only, it is .47 and .48 (FB and GB), respectively.  With first and second and no outs, it is .53 and .52, so fly balls are normal and ground balls are hit more to the right side, I guess to help stay out of the DP, or maybe as a function of the hit and run.  With 2nd and 3rd, it is .5 and .55, so ground balls are normal and fly balls are a little to the right side.  With a runner on third in general, we see more fly balls to the right side.  My guess is that with zero and one out and a runner on 3rd, the batter is trying to hit a fly ball, which results in more fly balls to the opp field for both lefties and righties.  In fact, with a runner on 3rd only, we see .48 for FB.  With one out, we see .5 and with 2 outs, we see .51.


Anyway, I was most interested in the rates of s,d,t,hr,bb, and k, given the various base/out states.  I don’t know how I can show you the entire results without linking to a spreadsheet, but here are some highlights:

Everything is presented as a ratio of what happens at a certain base/out state compared to overall (all base/out states combined).

With no one on and no one out, we see more extra base hits, including the HR and more triples, even per non-HR extra base hit.  We see a lot less BB and HP.  (BTW, we see the HP mimic the BB in terms of the base/out state, so it appears that the HP is not nearly a random event!) We also see slightly less SO.  Here are the numbers:

s 0.99
ex 1.03
d/ex 1.00
t/ex 1.04
hr 1.07
bb 0.89
hp 0.89
so 0.96
roe 0.91

BTW, you see many fewer ROE with no runners on base than with runners on base, for all numbers of outs, for obvious reasons (more pressure on the fielders.

But wait, you might ask, what about the batters’ overall talent for this base/out state? Isn’t the pool of batters overrepresented by lead-off men?  Sure.  So I adjusted for the pool of batters faced at that base/out state.  (My next step is to adjust for the pool of pitchers for each base/out state.)

Here are all the batters that hit in that state, as compared to all batters:

s 1.01
ex 1.00
d/ex 0.99
t/ex 1.09
hr 0.97
bb 1
hp 1.01
so 1
roe 1.01

As you can see, a pretty normal group of batters, other than HR rate.  So the “effective” HR rate for this base/out state is not 1.07, but 1.09! You might also say, “This is a little circular.  The batters in this pool will tend to see more of this state than other states, so their overall stats are affected as well.” And you would be right.  I don’t think it makes enough difference to want to do a recursive analysis, but you could to be more accurate.  And of course the fact that batters tend to change their batting order position tends to mitigate this “circular” effect.

What about an “extreme” base/out state like loaded and 1 out. What do batters and pitchers do?  It is important to keep in mind that batters and pitchers don’t HAVE to change their approach.  They do so voluntarily, on order to leverage the base/out state, at least presumably so.  I guess it is also possible that there are things that they do subconsciously with various base/out states that are not necessarily optimal.  And, as I already mentioned, part of the change in rates (s,d,t, etc.) is due to fielders being in different positions.

Here is what we get before adjusting for the pool of hitters:

foulout 1.11
s 1.02
ex 1.03
d/ex 1.01
t/ex 0.86
hr 0.91
bb 0.8
hp 1.38
so 0.94
roe 1.70

Lots of non-average things going on, as you can see.  Batters and pitchers do not like walks.  The HP is high though. I suspect that is because some batters will let themselves get hit with the bases loaded, since they know it is a run and an RBI.  Very high ROE.  I assume that is because there is a lot of pressure on the defense and because a small percentage of this base/out state is with the IF in.  That is also probably the reason for the higher singles and doubles rates. Low HR rate.  That is probably due to a combination of the batters trying to make contact and not striking out, and pitchers being loathe to give up a granny.  I am not sure why so many foul outs.  Maybe batters desiring to make contact and not strike out more. Let’s make sure there is not an unusual pool of hitters driving these unusual numbers.

foulouts 1.01
s 0.99
ex 1.00
d/ex 1.01
t/ex 0.94
hr 1.02
bb 1.00
hp 1.01
so 1.02
roe 0.99

We seem to have a pool of slight power-type hitters here - high HR and K, low triples.  So the low triples rate in this base/out state is not really that low after adjusting for the batter pool. The low HR rate ends up even lower and so does the low SO rate.  Here are the adjusted rates:

foul 1.1
s 1.02
ex 1.03
d/ex 1.01
t/ex 0.92
hr 0.9
bb 0.8
hp 1.36
so 0.92
roe 1.71

OK, one more:

Runner on second and no outs:

Since the batters (on the average) are obviously trying to move the runner along and in doing so have to alter their normal swing, let’s see what happens overall. Unfortunately, I did not remove pitcher hitting, so it includes pitchers bunting.

foulouts 0.94
s 1.05
ex 0.98
d/ex 1.00
t/ex 1.02
hr 0.82
bb 1.14
hp 1.38
so 0.86
roe 1.21

Looks like in an attempt to move runners over in general, batters get more singles, but much fewer extra base hits and HR.  Pitchers, as you would expect, walk a lot of batters (BTW, these walks do NOT include IBB) and hit a lot of batters.  In this case, with the bb and hp, the pitchers trump the batters as the batters are not trying to walk necessarily (although it is never a bad thing to walk with no one out, no matter what the base situation - in fact, I suspect that pitchers are walking too many batters in an attempt to be too “fine” with a runner on second and a base open).  Interestingly, there are few K even though pitchers are probably trying to K the batter and are also throwing a lot of pitches outside of the K zone (hence more walks).  The batter trumps there I guess since he is really trying hard not to K.  And as usual with runners on base, there are many more ROE’s.  For some reason, there are many fewer foulouts.  I am not sure why.  Let’s look at the batter pool and then the adjusted numbers:

foul 1.00
s 1.01
ex 1.00
d/ex 1.00
t/ex 0.99
hr 0.98
bb 1.00
hp 0.99
so 0.99
roe 1.00

A pretty typical batter, a little short on HR and long on singles, a pool probably over-represented by the #2 batter in the order.  Here are the batter adjusted rates for this base/out state:

foul 0.94
s 1.04
ex 0.97
d/ex 1.00
t/ex 1.04
hr 0.83
bb 1.14
hp 1.4
so 0.87
roe1.21

OK, one more. Let’s compare that to a runner on second and 2 outs, where the batter is definitely not trying to move the runner over, the pitcher is not trying to strike out the batter (just get an out), although here he definitely does mind a walk, and the batter should be trying to get a hit to drive in the runner (as opposed to hitting an extra base hit or home run like he might with a runner on 1st or no one on) and definitely does not want to walk if he can help it.

foul 0.97
s 0.97
ex 1.04
d/ex 0.97
t/ex 1.25
hr 0.97
bb 1.5
hp 1
so 1.09
roe 0.92

Kind of an odd profile with 2 outs and a runner on 2nd.  First of all, I mispoke when I said that with runners on base there was always a high ROE rate.  With 2 outs, that is not usually the case, other than 2nd and 3rd for some reason.  Anyway, even though batters should be trying to get more singles and not try for the extra base hit, they get fewer singles and more extra base hits.  Fewer HR’s though, which is probably expected. In fact, with 2 outs, you see HR depressed across the board.  I guess that pitchers do not like to give up the HR with 2 outs and rightfully so.  So pitchers trump there.  Lots more BB as you would expect, but only average HP, which is odd, as in other base/out states, as I said, pitchers appear to control the HP and they tend to mimic the BB rate. Also, a lot of K for some reason.  Neither batters nor pitchers should be trying for the K.  Maybe because pitchers are throwing to the corners no minding a walk, batters are K’ing more. With one out (and a runner on second), we see high BB but not high K, so maybe batters are more impatient with 2 outs and swing more at the bad pitches.  We also see more triples relative to doubles.  I am not sure why. With 2 outs, you would expect to see batters not trying for the third when it is going to be close.  The only thing I can think of, which is probably true, is that with a runner on 2nd and 2 outs, the OF is playing a little close to cut down the runner on a hit, such that a ball in the gap or over their heads is more likely to be a triple. THat may be the reason we see more extra base hits in general and fewer singles, the exact opposite of what we would expect from the correct batter approach.

Let’s look at the pool of batters:

foul 1.00
s 1.00
ex 1.00
d/ex 1.00
t/ex 0.99
hr 1.03
bb 1.01
hp 1.01
so 1.01
roe 0.99

Fairly normal - a little heavy on the HR and walks.

So here are the overall rates for that base/out state, adjusted for the batters:

foul 0.97
s 0.97
ex 1.04
d/ex 0.97
t/ex 1.26
hr 0.94
bb 1.48
hp 0.99
so 1.08
roe 0.92

Next time I will look at the pitcher pools for each base/out state to see if that makes much of a difference.  That might make a big difference, but then again, you have more of a circular effect (although the effect could be in the opposite direction - for example, if a pitcher walks the bases loaded a lot - with the bases loaded, he will walk fewer than his overall walk rate). For example, with the bases loaded, you probably have a pool of pitchers who give up a lot of hits and walks.  But then again, their overall stats are influenced by the fact that they face a lot of batters with the bases loaded.

BTW, I am not the only person to come up with this, but in small samples, maybe even for a year or two. we probably should be adjusting batters lines for the base/out state they come up in.  For example, with the sluggers, their walk (non-IBB) totals will clearly be heavily influenced by how often they come to bat with a base open.

#1          (see all posts) 2009/03/19 (Thu) @ 06:02

I just ran one year of the pitcher pools by base/out state.  The results are fascinating!

By “pitcher pools” I mean the s,d,t,hr,bb,so, etc. rate of the average pitcher who finds himself pitching in each base/out state, as compared to the average pitcher in baseball. 

To do that, I did the same thing as I did with the hitter pools.  That is, for every PA in each season, I put that PA into one of 24 buckets, where each bucket is one of the 24 base/out states.

Then for that PA, I looked at the batter and the pitcher.  I recorded that batter’s and the pitcher’s full season stats ONE TIME for that bucket.  So, for example, if the pitcher’s full season (for that year) HR rate was 15 per 500 PA, I added that to whatever the base/out bucket was for that PA.  I did the same thing for the batter.

I then added up all the rates in each of the buckets (each PA is weighted by one of course), and divided that by the league average hitter and pitcher.  This time I did not include any PA in which a pitcher batted.

Anyway, as it turns out and as we may have expected, the base/out states where there is no one on base had a pitcher pool of low BB and singles pitchers (and slightly high HR).  I don’t know why the pool was a high HR pool.  Either HR leads to bases empty, which they do, or when you pitch a lot to the bases empty you tend to give up more HR. Or maybe it is both.  In any case, the BB rates were like .97 and .98 times the league average rate and the HR rates are only like 1.01.

With runners on base, we start to see low HR rates (remember I am talking about the pitcher pools in these base/out states, based on the pitchers’ full season stats) on the order of .96 to .98 and very high BB and HP rates on the order of 1.05 to 1.10 and slightly high S rates, on the order of 1.01 or 1.02.  The more the runners, the higher the BB, HP, and singles rates, and the same is true for the higher number of outs and the BB rate.  For example, with the bases loaded and no outs, the pitcher pool had a 1.02 singles rate, a .93 HR rate (I think that is a small sample anomaly), and a 1.07 BB (and 1.11 HP rate) rate.  With 2 outs, it was .99 singles, .96 HR, and 1.11 BB and 1.12 HP.

Anyway, I though this was fascinating…


#2    dan      (see all posts) 2009/03/19 (Thu) @ 16:28

Obviously not a lot of comments on the thread, but I found this to be very interesting.


#3    MGL      (see all posts) 2009/03/19 (Thu) @ 16:56

Lately, the threads that report boring statistical data are not getting much air time.

Here is something else that came out of the data that I also find interesting that most people are probably not aware of (but is intuitive):

Wild pitches with a runner on 3rd, 2nd and 3rd, and bases loaded are right around half the rate (per PA) as with other runner configurations.  There are 2 possible reasons:  One, it is hard to advance home on an errant pitch, obviously.  Two, pitchers and catchers are more careful with a runner on 3rd.  The first reason is probably the primary one, since we see about twice as many wp with runners on 1 and 3 (and a little more than with a runner on 1st only) as with runners on 3rd only.

We also see the WP rate increase as the number of outs increases, for all baserunner states.

We see the same thing with PB.


#4    Guy      (see all posts) 2009/03/19 (Thu) @ 17:44

Ditto Dan’s comment—very interesting stuff, lack of comments notwithstanding.


#5    Tangotiger      (see all posts) 2009/03/20 (Fri) @ 17:00

Ok, finally got a chance to read this.  It takes concentration to read this one.  MGL, it might help to put mini-headlines between each section.  Makes it easier to figure out where you are.

Now, I’ve done this kind of work before, but I never controlled for the pools of players (I should have).  And the HBP was always as random as anything else.  Maybe things have changed from when I looked at it a few years ago.  I can generate the counts by base/out states very easily (without controlling for pools of players).  I’ll do that tonight.

Without question, the #1 state to look at is: runner on 3B, less than 2 outs.  In that state, the run values of the events change dramatically, and notably for the two things the pitcher has most control: K, BB.

So, I would think that has to be the starting spot in this kind of discussion.

Look at posts #2 here:
http://www.insidethebook.com/ee/index.php/site/comments/leverage_index_by_base_out_states/#2

Look at the “k/bo” column.  Anything away from 1.0 means that this event has a disporportionate impact at that base/out state.  Notice how much the runner on 3B, less than 2 outs stands out?

It’s no surprise here.  So, I would say: look there first.

Plus, then break it down between guys who have a good command of the strike zone (Mo) and those who don’t (Benitez).  And do the same on the hitter’s side.


#6    MGL      (see all posts) 2009/03/20 (Fri) @ 18:39

Tango, can you print in this thread, the HP rates for the various base/out states?  As I said, even without controlling for the pool of batters and pitches, my data indicates that HP rates mimic BB rates in most cases, and are not even close to being random.  At least for 06-08.

How would you define “good command of the strike zone” in order to break up the data?  I suppose you can use some combination of BB and K rates, but what you really want to know is who actually has the ability to “command” the zone.  By that, I mean, let’s say you have a pitcher who can throw to virtually any spot he wants, like a Maddux or a Mo.  Depending upon his pitches and the style he prefers, as well as other things, he can choose to throw lots of pitches in the zone, like a Maddux, who does not like to waste pitches even when ahead in the count, or he can be a nibbler.  Being a nibbler (on purpose) or choosing to throw most pitches in the zone will produce vastly different K and BB rates, even though the pitchers who choose one or the other may have exactly the same ability to “control” the pitches and the strike zone.

On the other hand, you may have a pitcher who has little control over where the pitch is going (like a Daniel Cabrera).  He, still, may choose to try and throw pitches in the zone because he likes his stuff (and presumably has good stuff) or just likes to pitch that way.  Or he may still try and hit corners more often and throw waste pitches when behind in the count, because his stuff is not good, he does not trust his stuff, or that’s just the way he likes to pitch.

That, BTW, is the difference between command and control (of course you can call it anything you want), at least that is my definition. Control is simply the number, whether they be (K-BB)/PA or (K-BB)/IP or K/BB. Command is a pitcher’s ability to throw the pitch where he wants.  As I just explained, control is command plus a pitcher’s choice as to how he likes to pitch.

For being able to leverage one’s approach to the game situation, command is the important thing, and not control.  Presumably a pitcher who throws a lot of strikes not because he has command but because he simply aims for the middle of the plate more often (like Wakefield) than other pitchers is not going to do as well in terms of tailoring his approach to the game situation than a pitcher who may not have the same control numbers (because he chooses to nibble in general - like a Dice K) but has better command.

Anyway, just though I would bring that up, as grouping pitchers by BB and K rates as a proxy for “command” of pitches is not the greatest way to do it, but may be the only way, unless we start getting into subjective evaluations.


#7    MGL      (see all posts) 2009/03/20 (Fri) @ 18:58

Here are my numbers.  Rates are per PA in that game state divided by overall league (NL and AL combined) averages across all base/out states.

0 outs BB HP

--- .88 .90
1-- .81 1.06
-2- 1.12 1.39
--3 1.09 1.75
12- .92 .98
1-3 .84 1.12
-23 .94 2.01
123 .64 1.18

1 outs BB HP

--- .96 .87
1-- .91 1.08
-2- 1.32 1.16
--3 1.25 1.70
12- .98 1.12
1-3 .87 1.23
-23 1.19 1.54
123 .79 1.28

2 outs BB HP

--- 1.06 .87
1-- .95 .89
-2- 1.51 1.00
--3 1.45 1.33
12- 1.11 1.18
1-3 1.20 1.43
-23 1.57 1.39
123 1.03 1.14

As you can see, with no one on base, the times you want least to hit a batter and the times that a batter most wants to ‘step into’ a pitch, especially with no outs, has the lowest HP rates, .88.

With a base open (2nd, 3rd, 2nd and 3rd), it is 1.47.  So the HP rate is 2/3 higher with a base open than with no runners on base. Even though we would think that batters are less likely to step into a pitch with a base open, pitches are clearly throwing way more errant pitches with bases open.  That should not be surprising as for individual pitchers, their HP rates mimic their walk rates, which should also not be surprising as your HP rate is a function of your control, which also dictates your BB rate.

Tango, why would you think that HP rate would be close to random as a function of base/out state?

The only anomalies I see in the data, and that could simply be a sample size issue, is that it seems that there are more HP across the board with a runner on third, even with the bases loaded when the BB rate is low. Look at the 1-3 and the 123 states for all outs as compared to the B rates. Anyone know why that would be?  Is the third base runner distracting the pitcher such that he throws more errant pitches but that does not influence his walk rate as much?

Also, with 2 outs, it looks like there are not as many HP with a base open as you would expect, even though the BB rates are high, as you would expect.  Are batters so averse to getting hit with a runner in scoring position and 2 outs, that they are REALLY getting out of the way so they can prolong the AB and drive in the run?


#8    Tangotiger      (see all posts) 2009/03/20 (Fri) @ 20:11

MGL, I take it back.  I guess I got lulled by two things:
1 - the rates are so low, that they looked “the same”.  But, when I look at it, relative to their low mean, they are obviously not the same.

2 - the LWTS figures, empirical and Markov, were around the same, so I figured it was random

This is what I get for 1993-2008 for HBP:
Relative Outs Bases
0.7 0 Empty
0.7 1 Empty
0.7 2 Empty

0.8 0 1B only
0.9 1 1B only
0.8 2 1B only

1.1 0 2B only
0.9 1 2B only
0.8 2 2B only

1.0 0 1B & 2B
0.9 1 1B & 2B
0.9 2 1B & 2B

1.2 0 3B only
1.3 1 3B only
1.0 2 3B only

1.1 0 1B & 3B
1.1 1 1B & 3B
1.1 2 1B & 3B

1.4 0 2B & 3B
1.2 1 2B & 3B
1.0 2 2B & 3B

1.1 0 Loaded
1.1 1 Loaded
0.9 2 Loaded

Runner on 3B or no runners at all seems to be the theme for HBP.

It would be interesting to break it down into “career HBP” guys, like Biggio, and “career headhunters”, and not.

Ideally, those guys not really involved with HBP probably see random patterns, while Biggio and headhunters are more selective.


#9    MGL      (see all posts) 2009/03/20 (Fri) @ 21:41

Looks like “pitcher control” but again, the numbers are odd with a runner on 3rd.  Too high.


#10    MGL      (see all posts) 2009/03/20 (Fri) @ 21:45

2 - the LWTS figures, empirical and Markov, were around the same, so I figured it was random

You mean, the same as the BB?  That would mean that it is NOT random, like the BB is not random, right?

Given the numbers, I would say that it is a very safe bet to group the HP in with the BB, which is what I have always done anyway, especially since for pitchers, they go hand in hand (not so for batters).

I’ve said this before and I will say it again, any metric which ignores HP, either for the batters, and especially for the pitcher, is making a big mistake. And lots of them do.  The same is true, but maybe not as bad, for including the IBB and treating is at a normal BB.  Lots of metrics do that as well.


#11    Tangotiger      (see all posts) 2009/03/21 (Sat) @ 17:30

I meant that if I presumed random for HBP in my model, I get a run value similar to the empirical.

If I presumed random for BB, I get a run value that is .02 greater than the empirical.  So, for the BB, I cannot have a model where it was random.


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