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Monday, April 21, 2008

Now this is good stuff: Fastball speeds

By , 04:42 AM

With all due respect to the previous work, by all of the pitch f/x researchers.  This is exactly the kind of stuff that needs to be done to understand what the heck goes on from the mound to home plate, and exactly the kind of stuff that teams need to know in order to train and evaluate pitchers.  Any team that isn’t reading these articles, or doing their own similar research, is, let’s say gently, not yet on the technological bandwagon, and is in jeopardy of being left in the dust.


One thing you can clearly see from John’s data and analysis is that you don’t need to pitch down in the zone to be effective, at least with the fastball.  In fact, the best place to throw the fastball, in general, is UP in the zone.  And that goes for soft tossers as well as guys that can bring the heat.

Every pitcher has been taught since Little League, to keep the ball down, no?  That may be bad advice, at least as a general rule.  Of course, what makes the high fastball seemingly a little better than the low one, may be the fact that it is not thrown high all the time.  There is a lot of game theory in pitch location as well as selection per se.  It might just be that pitchers (not all, of course) throw the right amount of pitches up and the right amount down.  But, no matter what, I think it is pretty clear that it is NOT correct to consistently throw your fastball down in the zone.  Now that obviously does not apply to ALL fastballs.  Maybe it is better to throw more 2-seamers down and more 4-seamers up and it is probably likely that most sinkers (even the 93-94 mph sinkers that Webb and Wang throw) should be thrown low, even if the batter knows that. 

What do you think many pitching coaches would say if you told them that the most effective fastball, in general, is the high one and not the low one, given the percentage of high and low fastballs that are currently thrown (I’m not sure that many of them would understand that last clause)?  I think a lot of them would look at you as if you were crazy!  Isn’t Mazzone lionized because he proposes throwing everything (not literally) down and away?

Anyway, when I first saw John’s graph of the low and away fastball and the fact that fast and slow fastballs were equally effective, I was a little surprised, but not that surprised.  I right away thought that there was a huge selective sampling effect at work when you look at the effectiveness among the various speed fastballs.  In order to survive, a slow fastball MUST have more movement, have more deception by the pitcher, and the pitcher probably mixes up his pitches more than a guy that throws 95 mph.  Also, even if you are looking at a specific location in the zone, like John was looking at the low and away segment of the zone, if a pitcher is more wild in general (like you expect the 95 mph guy to be), you might expect that the batter is going to be more selective on those pitches as opposed to against a control guy, like you expect the soft-tosser to be, such that, again, the soft tossers fastball is going to be more effective even given its slower speed.

I did not explain all of that very well, but what I am trying to say is that you CANNOT compare the quality of fastballs across different pitchers any more than you can do an aging study by comparing how all 25 year olds do as compared to all 26 year olds, etc.  The two problems you have with the pitch data is, one, a huge selective sampling issue, as I said, which is that there is going to be a gigantic difference between an 87 mph fastball thrown by a successful major league pitchers and an 87 mph fastball all of a sudden thrown by CC Sabathia or any other pitcher who normally throws in the 90’s, and two, as John mentions, that the effectiveness of a pitch depends on so many other factors other than speed, yet these other factors are hard to control for while still working with large samples of data.  (I also want to congratulate Johns for NOT doing a multiple regression.  They are WAY too opaque for anyone who is not a pHD level statistician to understand and really see what is going on.  When someone does a multiple regression, you pretty much have to take the results on faith.  Not that there is necessarily anything wrong with that.)

Anyway, to be honest, I’ve only read half of the article.  When I finish the rest, I’ll come back with more comments.  Despite some of the problems, some of which I have articulated, this is a great start, and long awaited.
Anyway…

#1          (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 05:40

The only thing I question about John’s “conclusions” are when he says that umpires are more likely to make a mistake on the low and away strike on the faster fastballs. Can we really say that?  Is it just as likely that either the pitch f/x accuracy on location is worse the faster a pitch is thrown, or, perhaps even more likely, that more of the faster fastballs in that low and away section are actually very close to being a ball than are the slower pitches, because, I assume, pitchers with slower pitches have more control?

One way to test that latter hypothesis is to look at all fastballs in that lower quadrant from two groups of pitchers with the same average collective speed.  One group is the good control pitchers and the other group is the bad control pitchers.  If my theory is correct, the bad control group will have more called balls in that low and away part of the strike zone than the good control group.

Of course, we’d also want to know if in fact, there is a smooth, probably linear relationship, between speed of fastball and control, which I am assuming there is.  At the least, we want to know the average “control” (e.g., percentage of pitches in the K zone, in general) number for each of the fastball groups (slow, medium, etc.).

Anyway, what I think is going on is that for away pitches, as a batter, you want to be late with your swing.  So a fast fastball away is actually a better pitch for a batter, since he does not always know the location of the pitch until he has already started his swing.  Maybe he hardly ever does.  I’m not sure.  So even though a slower fastball is generally easier to hit, when the pitch is outside, the fact that you want to be late on your swing, counteracts the negative value (from the pitcher’s perspective) of a slow pitch and helps the positive value of the fast fastball. 

Basically, with game theory obviously a large factor in the percentages, the faster a pitcher pitches, the more he needs and wants to throw inside.  Of course, there is the risk of hitting the batter with any inside pitch, especially the fastball, such that the less control you have, the less you want to throw inside, no matter what your fastball speed.  There is almost no doubt though, that a pitcher who throws hard, if he rarely throws inside, for whatever reason, is NOT throwing inside enough. There are definitely some pitchers like that.  There are very few soft tossers who throw inside too much, for obvious reasons, but I would also say that any soft tosser who rarely throws inside - and there are some pitchers like that too - probably don’t throw inside enough, just from a game-theory perspective.

The other thing is that as the game situation changes, so do the values of the offensive events, such that the “run values” of the various pitches in the various zones, using context dependent run values for all of the offensive events, change a lot.  That is something that really needs to be studied.  What is the optimal way to pitch in the various situations - base/out state, inning, score, etc.?  It changes a lot.  For example, with a 1-run lead and no one on base in he 9th inning, especially with 2 outs (or anytime you are trying to avoid a home run), it is probably not correct to throw much inside, even for a hard thrower, and certainly not for a soft tosser.  Of course, lots of this stuff pitchers, managers and pitching coaches already know intuitively, but I am sure there is a lot that can be tweaked with these kinds of analyses, and I am sure there is a lot that they know that will prove to be wrong.  How can there not be?


#2    Peter Jensen      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 05:41

There is no link to what you are talking about.


#3    John Walsh      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 06:32

mgl is talking about my article on THT today. Click my name for a link.

I will try to address mgl’s comments when I’ve had time to digest them.


#4          (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 06:52

Regarding Mazzone’s theory on the low, outside pitch, I believe that there was some game theory going on there. I watched many games during his tenure with the Braves and here’s what he liked to do. At the beginning of the game, he would have the catcher set up on the lower outside corner. The idea was for the pitcher to hit the catcher’s target consistently. As the game went on, the catcher would slowly move his target ever so slightly off of the plate in the hope that, if the pitcher hit the target, he would get the call even though the pitch was off of the plate. This technique worked well, especially for pitchers with good control, like Glavine and Maddux. I’ve seen overhead shots of their pitches, ones that were called strikes, that were never closer than three or four inches to the plate. In the QuestTec (sp?) era, I don’t know if that would still work.

I don’t know why he chose the low, outside corner specifically. I suspect that it was because, true or not, he believed that it was harder for the umpire to tell whether or not the catcher’s mitt was in the strike zone on low, outside pitches, since his head was over the catcher’s opposite shoulder.


#5    Tangotiger      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 11:04

Fantastic article.  I’ll comment as I read it.

This, of course, confirms the notion that to work inside you really have to bring the heat. Soft tossers best stay outside.

This follows that very cool 9-zone chart.  And this may be the selective sampling that MGL is talking about.  If it’s not, then I’ll say it.  If the guys who work on the outside of the plate are disproportionate right-handed Moyer/Glavine types, and the guys who work on the inside are the heat seekers, then this is what we’d expect to see.  It’s not about speed, but about the inference of the speed as to who threw the pitch.

What you REALLY want to know is the LWTS run value, relative to the pitcher’s OVERALL LWTS run value.  Remember way back when, when I said:
(a) sometimes it’s better to figure out the LWTS run value at the “through 0-0” count such that every pitcher, Santana or Lima, start at .000 runs, and
(b) sometimes you want the traditional one (whereby Santana would be at say -.050 runs, and Lima would be +.030 runs)? 
Well, this is the perfect example of setting the LWTS run value such that every pitcher starts at .000.... especially since John said that he couldn’t control for all the other stuff since it would kill his sample size.

So, here we see a definite disadvantage to throwing hard—you have a greater chance of a bad call from the umpire. That sucks doesn’t it? Ninety-eight mph heater at the knees on the outside black: BALL! calls the ump. Same exact location, but now it’s thrown at 86 mph: STRIKE! Maybe this is the reason that guys like Tom Glavine, who work the outside corner with soft stuff, seem to get more than their share of close calls.

Yowza.  The speed of the pitch, thrown to the exact same spot, determines the rate at which it’s called a ball (relative to all pitches that were taken)?  Yowza. 

This is the percentage of balls in play resulting in home runs.

Not a fan here.  After all, a big swinger might be a HR or K kind of guy.  I would prefer to look at HR per swings, not per contacts-in-play.  I suppose both can tell you something, but I’d focus first on the intent of the batter, and that’s his swing.

***

Agreed with MGL that this was as fantastic piece, in that it sheds some new light on controlling the strike zone.


#6    Mike Green      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 11:17

This is great stuff from John, as usual. 

I would have thought that the better comparison for the low/outside pitch would have been the one up and in rather than one thigh high. I could have guessed the conclusion for the thigh high pitch, but I really don’t know what it will be for the one up and in.

The corollary to the proposition that pitchers who throw 97 have more leeway within the strike zone is that it is more difficult, in general, to hit the sweet spots in the strike zone when one is throwing 97 than when one is throwing 91. You can test this by % in each zone by speed of pitch.


#7    Tangotiger      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 11:24

More comments at ballhype:
http://ballhype.com/story/the_hardball_times_how_fast_should_a_fastball_be/


#8    Peter Jensen      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 14:06

This is a very interesting article and very thought provoking, but I am having a hard time visualizing how useful the information is.  The basic conclusions are that slower fastball pitchers have found a way to make their slower fastballs equal in effectiveness to faster fastballs when they locate their pitches low and away.  I would think they would have to do that to be able to stay in the major leagues.  They don’t have the options that fast fastball pitchers have to be less precise with their pitches.  I also think that John’s conclusion about faster fastball pitchers getting fewer calls on the SAME pitches on the outside corner is not supported by the data.  I think a more likely explanation is that the slower fastball pitchers are able to locate their pitches more precisely, and therefore are able to take advantage of umpires with a wider strike zone and adjust to umpires with a narrower strike zone without leaving their pitches over the center of the plate.

If anyone could help me understand how the information in this research will be able to help pitchers change the way they pitch to become more effective I would like the help.


#9    Tangotiger      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 14:19

Peter, fascinating thought.  Therefore, we could look at the specific umpire/pitcher combination to see how the outside pitch is being called a ball or not, based on the fastball speed.

As for your last paragraph, I don’t know that it does anything yet, but it’s part of the foundation.


#10    John Walsh      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 15:34

Lots of comments today, good.  I will try to get through them…

Intro/1 (mgl): Yes, selection bias is in there, no question.  I don’t think it’s as bad as in the case of studying age, since I am controlling (albeit not perfectly) for several influences: location and movement (by pitch type) primarily.  With enough data, we could look at pitch sequence and ball-strike count. Don’t ask me about deception, I don’t know how to even think about that.

Regarding the umps missing more on harder thrown balls: I doubt that the accuracy of pfx depends much on speed. Those cameras take 60 pics per second, or around 20-25 for a typical fastball. The faster pitches will have a data point or two fewer along the ball’s trajectory, but I don’t believe it has much of an effect.

As for the slower pitches being more safely in the strike zone, that would have to be checked. My intuition (not worth much, I’ll concede) tells me that the distribution within the low-and-away zone is not different for the different speed pitches.


#11    Peter Jensen      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 16:10

John - The one graph that I wanted to see that you didn’t have was the percentage of total fastballs of each pitch speed classification in each of the nine pitch locations.  Also I am assuming that you used your own pitch classification system.  Do you classify each pitch manually or is it automated?  Have you compared your system to Sportvision’s?  How well does your system differentiate between the different types of fastballs by movement?


#12    Jim P      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 16:23

One possible explanation for the “bad call” is that the faster pitches might be missing their target by more.  Isn’t there a known bias that a pitch that the catcher doesn’t have to move his glove for is more likely to be called a strike than an identically-located pitch that is not where the catcher sets up?  Location is less important for a faster fastball so I’d expect lower accuracy, so low-and-away fastballs are more likely to be mistakes (but in a good way) than for slower pitchers.


#13    John Walsh      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 16:42

4/ To be honest, I chose the low-and-away zone randomly.  Well, maybe not randomly, as I was probably thinking (sub-consciously) that this was the best zone from the pitcher’s viewpoint. 

I had no idea about the difference in called balls in that zone—I hadn’t even thought about looking at that particular stat when I started working on this.  I sort of stumbled across it, I guess.


#14    John Walsh      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 16:48

5/Tango

I can make the HR/swing plot.  In focusing on HR/bip, I was thinking of de-coupling from the other plots - I had already shown miss pct and ball pct and (linked to) babip.  The missing piece was HR/bip. That was my thinking, anyway.


#15    MGL      (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 17:48

#12, that is true and it very well could be why we see an umpire bias against the hard throwers.. 

Also, John, since you are looking at called balls as a percentage of pitches not swung at, can we assume that the distribution of pitches (in terms of location) not swung at might be different for the two groups?

What if all pitches on the black, in that low and away section, were not swung at for the hard throwers, and for the soft tossers, the pitches not swung at were more randomly distributed in that low and away section, which is actually plausible (more or less).  When you get a 97 mph fastball right on the low and away black, you might as well not even swing.  If it is 85, you have a chance to hit it.

Anyway, if that were the case, then the hard throwers would have more balls called per pitches not swung at, through no bias or fault of the umpires.

Peter, are you kidding about this kind of work not being helpful to pitchers?  How else can you figure out, based on your basic repetoire, which parts of the plate are most effective for you?  Sure, pitchers will basically figure out the same thing through trial and error and the wisdom and experience of 100 years of baseball, but as I said in my earlier post:

There is no way that wisdom, experience, and trial and error will get them the same precision as these kinds of analyses (and yes, this article is merely the foundation), AND there are going to end up being some things that pitchers and pitching coaches have gotten completely wrong!


#16          (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 18:54

Same exact location, but now it’s thrown at 86 mph: STRIKE! Maybe this is the reason that guys like Tom Glavine, who work the outside corner with soft stuff, seem to get more than their share of close calls.

Maybe guys like Tom Glavine and Greg Maddux throwing in the slower buckets are why the slower pitches tend to be called strikes more.  We know that fastballs slow down as pitchers age, right?  And we know that as pitchers age, they only stay in the major leagues if they’re still moderately good (which usually means in their prime, they were probably quite good).  Makes total sense to me that there would be a halo effect here.

The only thing missing from this line of logic is knowing whether old veterans “get the call” more than young guys… which I suspect is the case from watching Glavine and Schilling throw.

And not to beat a dead horse, but thoroughly enjoyable article.


#17          (see all posts) 2008/04/21 (Mon) @ 19:18

Is there any way to look at whether 96 mph fastballs have a greater impact on setting up slower pitches than does an 86 mph one?


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