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Tuesday, September 07, 2010

Changing bats

By Tangotiger, 02:17 PM

Here’s Bill James on a zero-tolerance policy of bats coming out of hitters hands:

There is a really, really simple solution to this problem that is absolutely certain to work.  You make a rule that if the bat OR ANY PART OF THE BAT is thrown by the batter more than 40 feet from home plate, the batter is automatically out, and it goes as a strikeout.  If you do that, I guarantee you that hitters will discover real quick that a) they CAN hold on to the bat, and b) they can find bats that don’t shatter on contact.  The absence of such a rule allows the batter to get the benefits of a vicious cut and a bat designed for maximum bat speed, but excuses him the dangerous consequences of this combination.  That’s unnatural.  The natural thing is simply to hold the batter responsible for the bat.

From a baseball-fan perspective, I have no qualms with this.  I like it for its inventiveness. 

In hockey, if your stick shatters, you are required to IMMEDIATELY drop that stick.  Players then lose several seconds skating back to the bench, or worse, staying in their own zones otherwise their team will be shorthanded. 

So, it goes back to the test I was proposing with golf: (1) seriousness of offense, and (2) proportional remedy for offense.

In hockey, having a broken stick is dangerous.  Same applies for baseball, though not as much.  Hockey players are in closer proximity, always moving, and not necessarily focused on the player with the broken stick.  So, I agree that it is a seriousness enough offense that it should be codified.  Now, what about remedy?  In hockey, as I stated, you are basically depriving your team of a skater for a short period of time.  The remedy is pretty good there.  I wouldn’t go to two minutes penalty, because that would be excessive for something that is essentially a fluke.  But, there has to be a cost. 

What about baseball?  Automatic strikeout is excessive.  Giving one strike seems perfectly in keeping with the proportionality of the offense, as well as being similar to what pitchers do that earn automatic balls (going to hand).  This will nudge the batter toward getting a more shatter-resistant bat, and getting a better grip on the bat.


#1          (see all posts) 2010/09/07 (Tue) @ 17:49

I like the idea for the automatic out, however, if only to start the discussion process. There’s going to be some resistant to the idea but this gives some wiggle room to get to an additional strike - if the batter has 2 strikes then it’s an out.


#2    Lee Panas      (see all posts) 2010/09/07 (Tue) @ 19:01

My first thought was that it an automatic strike is more appropriate.  I think that an automatic out is excessive.  I do think the bats have become a serious problem which needs to be addressed.  I’m pretty sure the automatic strike would work quite well. I doubt baseball will do anything until pressured to do so (by a serious injury perhaps). 

Lee


#3    Scott Segrin      (see all posts) 2010/09/07 (Tue) @ 21:04

I like it and I think an automatic out works.  When the bat leaves the batters hand, either by slipping out or by breaking, its already a strike (because he swung) or ball in play which often times results in an out anyway.  Making the pitch on which the event occurs an automatic strike is really no penalty.  Adding an additional strike beyond that is often the same thing (would result in strike three) unless the initial event occurred with no strikes on the hitter.

At the risk of digressing from the topic, what if you did this and also awarded the batter second base on a HBP as a counter balance?


#4    Ryan JL      (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 00:17

When I read the title, I thought this thread was going to be about this.


#5    Ryan JL      (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 00:35

Ugh, wish I could edit, this is the link I meant.  Sorry.


#6    Kyle Boddy      (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 04:05

I think that lumping a shattering bat and a thrown bat together is a little silly. They’re clearly two different offenses.

I’d use Tango’s one-strike idea for a shattered bat and Bill’s automatic out (strikeout) for a thrown bat.


#7    Scott Segrin      (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 07:12

I’m sure this guy would love to see this rule change.  I’ve seen him interviewed.  He pitched this to MLB but it fell on deaf ears.


#8    Jeff Z      (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 08:52

With extra strikes for broken bats, getting on base vs. Mariano Rivera would be close to impossible.


#9          (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 13:04

For Scott Segrin (#7):

The radially-constructed bat is an intriguing idea, but…

a) You’ll go astray if you think of wood as being anything like a uniform material, except in the crudest sense; it’s not that rare to see board-to-board (even if they’re from the same tree) variations that approach species-to species differences.

b) Any piece of lumber (whether it’s 1-1/2 by 3-1/2 inch for framing, 3/4 by 5-1/2 for trimwork, or 3 by 3 for turning a bat on a lathe) will present, from edge-to-face, different cellular characteristics ("grain") that greatly determine whether gluing it to another piece will succeed.

c) Even workaday adhesives (like you can get at the local big-box store) will, with any care at all, produce a glued joint stronger than the adjacent wood fibers.

d) In the end, you are at the mercy of the qualities of either a given chunk of wood (traditional bat) or a bunch of pie-shaped chunks (composite bat).

I’ll add, though, that based on 35 years of building houses and making furniture, I’d be very uncomfortable with using maple for a baseball bat.


#10    AMusingFool      (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 13:41

There’s also this as a technical solution.  Maybe next year?


#11    AMusingFool      (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 13:46

Err… technical solution to half the problem… I think an automatic out for throwing the bat is far from unreasonable.  Though the link Ryan (#5) pointed out claims to help that part of the equation.  Now we just need to look out for the slant-knob bat glove. smile


#12          (see all posts) 2010/09/08 (Wed) @ 14:36

Some comments:

1.  The radial bat has been extensively tested.  Although it can crack, it essentially never breaks into multiple pieces.  I have a similar bat (http://www.macdougallbats.com/) that the manufacturer sent me.  As my wife remarked, it looks like a fine piece of furniture.  And it looks like it would be very hard to break into multiple pieces.

2.  For a real education on different woods, maple vs. ash, why maple breaks the way it does, slope of grain, etc., have a look here:
http://www.woodbat.org/


#13          (see all posts) 2010/09/09 (Thu) @ 19:53

Most of the bats I see go in the stands are the result of a broken bat.  Need to address the broken bat issue first since someone (player or fan) is going to get killed.

Also, I would not allow any kids in the stands within range of a broken bat.  Make these seats kid free.

Not sure a bat thrown at 20-30 MPH is anymore dangerous than a foul LD hit 100 MPH.  The bat loses energy to rotational forces and impacts over a larger surface area, while the balls energy is distributed over a smaller area.


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